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Brexit Saga Update

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Post Neon Knight on Wed 12 Dec - 22:58

The Prime Minister, Theresa May, tonight won a leadership challenge by some in her party by 2 to 1. This means she continues as Conservtive leader and PM.

She will now resume the task of gaining a guarantee from the European Union that the current exit deal would not mean the UK being indefinitely stuck in the Customs Union, an arrangement to prevent a 'hard border' between northern and southern (Republic of) Ireland. The fear is that having customs checks on the border would provoke a return to violence. But many 'leavers' say this is really a non-issue that's being used to try to stop the UK from properly leaving the EU (and I'm inclined to agree).


Last edited by Neon Knight on Fri 14 Dec - 18:44; edited 2 times in total

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Post OsricPearl on Thu 13 Dec - 3:09

I don't see why she didn't get the no confidence vote. She hasn't been doing what she was supposed to do. Poor UK. Sad No
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Post Sary on Thu 13 Dec - 20:08

The Brexit saga seems like it has been going on for such a long time. The transition period will draw it out even longer.

it is only natural that it will take time and there will be some bumps along the way. Not everyone is going to be happy

I don't know much about British politics but, PM May seems to be a strong leader.
Fit enough to make hard decisions and move forward.
I like her, I am glad that she won the leadership challenge .

How about you NK, do you approve of the way she is handling Brexit.

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Post Neon Knight on Fri 14 Dec - 21:27

I'm not a fan of her party, but I think Theresa May is more conscientous than most politicians and has proved herself to be tough under a lot of pressure. The deal she is trying to get the other members of Parliament to support is not brilliant, but it's a good start and the most sensible way forward. Many of our politicians are behaving selfishly and ignoring the national interest. If they continue that way then the kind of civil unrest we've seen in France is likely to happen here.

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Post Sary on Sun 16 Dec - 4:03

I don't know what would ever compel a person to choose a career politics. Being thick skinned is definantly one of the requirements. It really is thankless job, no matter what you do, someone will not like it. People can be so fickle, approval ratings can plummet very quickly
Hopefully the protests in France have not set a precedent.

I hear a lot about the leavers and the remainers, but isn't it a bit too late for that kind of talk.  When put to the vote in 2016, it was decided that The United Kingdom would leave the EU.  That makes all of the U.K. leavers.
The politicains that are remainers should accept the decision put forth by the majority, and try to work together for a smooth transition. It makes no sense to keep voting on the same thing

Ok, now for a silly American question.....
I am wondering what the Queen thinks about all of the hoopla surrounding Brexit.
Is she a leaver or a remainer and did she even have a say in the Brexit deal?
What exactly is her role when it comes to politics?
She is so quiet!
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Post Neon Knight on Sun 16 Dec - 21:45

@Sary wrote:Ok, now for a silly American question.....
I am wondering what the Queen thinks about all of the hoopla surrounding Brexit.
Is she a leaver or a remainer and did she even have a say in the Brexit deal?
What exactly is her role when it comes to politics?
She is so quiet!

Not at all silly! There's some slight evidence that she favours leaving the EU:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/06/21/queen-asks-guests-to-give-her-3-reasons-why-britain-should-remai/

She is supposed to be politically neutral but occasionaly gives hints in support of some policy:
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/people/queens-birthday-five-times-elizabeth-ii-dropped-her-veil-of-neutrality-and-revealed-her-political-a6992781.html Selected quotes:

Scottish Referendum
The fact the Queen wanted Scotland to remain in Britain was something of an open secret. During the tense final days of the Scottish referendum campaign, the Queen made an unusual intervention into the political domain. Speaking on her Balmoral estate in Scotland, she said, “Well, I hope people will think very carefully about the future.”

Colonial Days
Speaking in Philadelphia in July 1976 during the bicentennial celebrations of American independence, the Queen revealed why she thought Britain had lost its American colonial outposts. In her own words, “We lost the American colonies because we lacked the statesmanship to know the right time and the manner of yielding what is impossible to keep”.

Turkey
According to author and broadcaster, Joan Smith, the Queen was not so keen for Turkey to enter the European Union. “I was present when the Queen made a comment that was both reactionary and unconstitutional,” alleges Smith. The commentator claims that she heard the comments on Turkey at a Christmas party at Downing Street. “The Queen turned to another person in the group and said: 'The EU is getting awfully big with 28 countries.’ They said that, actually, it was 27, 'but we are hoping Turkey will come in soon’, to which the Queen said, 'Oh, we don’t want Turkey to come in for a long time.’”



I must admit, I only know a couple of the Queen's powers but this looks like a good summary:

http://royalcentral.co.uk/blogs/insight/what-are-the-queens-powers-22069  Quoting:

The Royal Prerogative are a set number of powers and privileges held by The Queen as part of the British constitution. Nowadays, a lot of these powers are exercised on Her Majesty’s behalf by ministers – things such as issuing or withdrawing passports that, without the Royal Prerogative, would require an act of parliament each time. Over time, the prerogative powers have been used less and less though the important thing in our Constitutional Monarchy is that they still exist, they remain a means of protecting democracy in this country ensuring that no one can simply seize power.

Victorian constitutionalist Walter Bagehot defined The Queen’s rights as, the right ‘to be consulted, to encourage and to warn’ – but these rights are not the same as her powers, as we will now see. The Queen’s prerogative powers vary and fall into different categories…

Political Powers
The Queen’s political powers nowadays are largely ceremonial, though some are actively used by The Queen such as at General Elections or are available in times of crisis and some are used by Ministers for expediency when needed.

Summoning/Proroguing Parliament
The Queen has the power to prorogue (suspend) and to summon (call back) Parliament – prorogation typically happens at the end of a parliamentary session, and the summoning occurs shortly after, when The Queen attends the State Opening of Parliament.

Royal Assent
It is The Queen’s right and responsibility to grant assent to bills from Parliament, signing them into law. Whilst, in theory, she could decide to refuse assent, the last Monarch to do this was Queen Anne in 1708.

Secondary Legislation
The Queen can create Orders-in-Council and Letters Patent, that regulate parts to do with the Crown, such as precedence, titles. Orders in Council are often used by Ministers nowadays to bring Acts of Parliament into law.

Appoint/Remove Ministers
Her Majesty also has the power to appoint and remove Ministers of the Crown.

Appointing the Prime Minister
The Queen is responsible for appointing the Prime Minister after a general election or a resignation, in a General Election The Queen will appoint the candidate who is likely to have the most support of the House of Commons. In the event of a resignation, The Queen listens to advice on who should be appointed as their successor.

Declaration of War
The Sovereign retains the power to declare war against other nations, though in practice this is done by the Prime Minister and Parliament of the day.

Freedom From Prosecution
Under British law, The Queen is above the law and cannot be prosecuted – she is also free from civil action.

Judicial Powers
The Queen’s judicial powers are now very minimal, and there is only really one which is used on a regular basis, with others having been delegated to judges and parliament through time.

Royal Pardon
The Royal Pardon was originally used to retract death sentences against those wrongly convicted. It is now used to correct errors in sentencing and was recently used to give a posthumous pardon to WW2 codebreaker, Alan Turing.

Armed Forces
The Queen’s powers in the Armed Forces are usually used on the advice of Generals and Parliament though some functions are retained by The Queen herself nowadays.

Commander-in-Chief
The Queen is commander-in-chief of the Armed Forces and all members swear an oath of allegiance to The Queen when they join; they are Her Majesty’s Armed Forces.

Commissioning of Officers
The Queen’s powers include the commissioning of officers into the Armed Forces and also removing commissions (when members of the Armed Forces salute officers, they are saluting The Queen’s commission).

Disposition of the Forces
The organisation and disposition of the Armed Forces are part of the Royal Prerogative; the crown technically controls how the Armed Forces are used.

Honours
One of the main prerogative powers that are still used personally by The Queen these days is the power to grant honours. As all honours derive from the Crown, The Queen has the final say on knighthoods, peerages and the like.

Creation of Peerages [Lords and Ladies]
The Queen may create a peerage for any person – whether a life peerage or hereditary one, though hereditary peerages haven’t been issued for decades outside of the Royal Family.

Font of Honour
It is The Queen’s prerogative power to create orders of knighthood and to grant any citizen honours. From the Royal Victorian Order to the Order of the Garter.

Miscellaneous Powers
Other powers Her Majesty holds include:

Control of Passports
The issuing and withdrawal of passports are within the Royal Prerogative – this is often used by ministers on behalf of The Queen. All British passports are issued in The Queen’s name.

Brexit Saga Update Ukpassport-cover

Incidentally, the name Great Britain means 'the largest island of the British Isles'; it doesn't mean 'brilliant/wonderful/fantastic Britain' or something like that, which many people assume it does.

Requisitioning of Ships
This power allows a ship to be commandeered in Her Majesty’s name for service to the realm. This power was used on the QE2 to take troops to the Falklands after the Argentine invasion in 1982.



There are more details here, including some obscure stuff:
https://www.businessinsider.com/weirdest-powers-queen-elizabeth-ii-british-sovereign-prerogative-swans-dolphins-2015-5?r=UK&IR=T

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Post Sary on Mon 17 Dec - 22:01

Thanks for the information NK , that is a very interesting read.
I am fascinated with the Royals!

Most of the Queens powers are symbolic, but none the less still in use, observed and a traditional part of English culture.
I see that the Queen is still considered The Defender of the Faith.
I like that.
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Post Neon Knight on Wed 16 Jan - 0:33

A few hours ago the House of Commons rejected the Prime Minister's EU exit deal by 2 to 1. This now makes things very uncertain.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46885828

Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn has now tabled a vote of no confidence in the government, which could trigger a general election. The confidence vote is expected to be held at about 1900 GMT on Wednesday.

The defeat is a huge blow for Mrs May, who has spent more than two years hammering out a deal with the EU . . . The UK is still on course to leave on 29 March but the defeat throws the manner of that departure - and the timing of it - into further doubt.

MPs who want either a further referendum, a softer version of the Brexit proposed by Mrs May, to stop Brexit altogether or to leave without a deal, will ramp up their efforts to get what they want, as a weakened PM offered to listen to their arguments.

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Post Neon Knight on Sat 19 Jan - 3:00

A history woman on a politics programme last night made the point that this is the first time a British referendum result has been out of line with the opinion of Parliament, so it's a test of how truly democratic our representative are. And the answer seems to be 'Not very'.

From the Daily Mail, 18th Jan 2019:

And STILL you rage on at our MPs

Yesterday, we published a selection of Daily Mail and Mail Online readers’ letters that expressed scathing views of how preening politicians have created chaos over Brexit. Such correspondence keeps coming. Here’s another selection…

"We are a laughing stock thanks to those in Westminster. Crime is on the rise, housing is in short supply and our legal service is unfit for service. But our politicians are unwilling to resolve Brexit. It makes you want to weep." - MARIA, London.

"If the referendum vote has proved anything, it is that many MPs are just in politics for their own ends. They don’t believe in much more than their own egos and pockets. They certainly don’t believe in democracy or that they have a responsibility to serve the people who elected them. Let’s hope they are taught a lesson in the next General Election." - N. WOODS, Chilton, Co. Durham.

"With the shambles that is Brexit we should be grateful for one thing – that this bunch of thirdrate politicians was not around in 1939." - K.S. CAREY, Giffnock, Renfrewshire.

"It is unbelievable that some politicians say they are fearful of the alleged chaos Brexit would create, having spent years being nonchalant about the mess the country is already in. A country ‘in flux’ all the time is like a ship without a rudder." - IAN STEPHENSON, Alness, Ross-shire.

"Brexitjust goes to prove there’s no situation that can’t be made worse by politicians." - TONY DAVENPORT, Malpas, Cheshire.

"Politician (noun): applies to a person who has optimised the qualities of incompetence, corruption, dishonesty and selfishness into perfect synergy." - ROY WIDDOWSON.

"Given the mess we’re in, may I suggest that readers’ Brexit letters be printed on the front page of the Mail to wake up our seemingly dimwit politicians to this country’s simmering rage at their denial of the national will." - DOUG JENNINGS, Mickleton Glos.

"No groupof people could so consistently invent problems or make so many bad decisions as the pompous clowns we call MPs." - GEORGE MANN, Nottingham.

"After the expenses scandal, you would have thought our elected representatives would be more careful of antagonising voters. The Brexit fiasco is down to the fact that too many MPs have prioritised their own and their party’s ambitions before the wishes of those who elected them." - P. ROBB, Sheffield.

"MPs are behaving like petulant little children. They need time out on the naughty step." - MICHAEL ALBIN, Blackburn, Lancs.

"Politicians should be ashamed of themselves. Remember: we gave them their jobs and we can take them away again." - LENA, by email.

"Why don’t our shameful bunch of MPs want to sort out all the damage they have done in recent years? I would be surprised if a single one of them retains their seat in the next election." - GEORGE DAVENPORT, by email.

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Post Neon Knight on Sat 19 Jan - 21:49



That cheer told us so much about the state of the nation. Jonathan Swift said:

   ‘It is the folly of too many to mistake the echo of a London coffee-house for the voice of a Kingdom.’

This is our establishment today. They think their chatter, their fearmongering, their tweeting is the view of the nation, but in many cases it is the precise opposite. Last night, in that cheer, they heard the voice of the kingdom, and it will have terrified them. I hope it did.

https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2019/01/the-cheer-on-question-time-that-will-terrify-corbyns-labour/

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Post Neon Knight on Wed 27 Feb - 23:36

On 12th March there'll be another vote by MPs on whether or not to accept the Prime Minister's withdrawal agreement. If they reject it, it's likely there'll then be a call to delay the leaving process and then anything could happen after that, including a general election.

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Post Neon Knight on Wed 13 Mar - 8:33

Theresa May's 'improved' Withdrawal Agreement was rejected by 62:38 percent. A mistake, I think. Tonight they vote on whether or not to leave the EU without a deal - whether or not to 'crash out'. It'll probably be 'not'.

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Post Neon Knight on Wed 13 Mar - 22:17

They've voted for a motion to rule out a no-deal exit at any time. However, this does not change the legal situation of a no-deal exit occurring on March 29th unless the exit is delayed. Tomorrow they will vote on asking the EU for such an extension, either a short or long one.

Theresa May has half lost her voice and one minister resigned.

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Post OsricPearl on Thu 14 Mar - 2:42

@Neon Knight wrote:They've voted for a motion to rule out a no-deal exit at any time. However, this does not change the legal situation of a no-deal exit occurring on March 29th unless the exit is delayed. Tomorrow they will vote on asking the EU for such an extension, either a short or long one.

Theresa May has half lost her voice and one minister resigned.
Is it bad that I think this is funny? LOL 2
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Post Neon Knight on Thu 14 Mar - 18:31

@OsricPearl wrote:
@Neon Knight wrote:They've voted for a motion to rule out a no-deal exit at any time. However, this does not change the legal situation of a no-deal exit occurring on March 29th unless the exit is delayed. Tomorrow they will vote on asking the EU for such an extension, either a short or long one.

Theresa May has half lost her voice and one minister resigned.
Is it bad that I think this is funny? LOL 2
I dunno. You gave yourself 9/10 for compassion, so either it's not bad or you're having your 10% psycho time Very Happy

BBC: "UK MPs have voted by 412 to 202 for Prime Minister Theresa May to ask the EU for a delay to Brexit. It means the UK may not now leave on 29th March as previously planned. Mrs May says Brexit could be delayed by three months, to 30th June, if MPs back her withdrawal deal in a vote next week. If they reject her deal again then she says she will seek a longer extension - but any delay has to be agreed by the 27 other EU member states."

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